Right-Enhancement for the "normal" (moderator) folks

[AimMe]

Cookies (not your Cookie, another cookie. Uncle probably knows who i talk about) made a bot that would kick a player off the server if his skill level was too low.
If you can kick someone cause he isn't playing well enough, then it should be possible to create a bot that would activate if certain team isn't doing so well, and swap players from one team to another to balance things out.
That part is probably the easiest part. The hard part actually is how to make the bot stop. If it transfers too many good players, the game will just turn into one team destroying the other in turns. If it doesn't transfers enough players then it didn't change much.
So the main problem is how to create a "smart" bot that can determine how many players need to be swapped in order to create 'balanced' teams.

Hmmm can't we just make bot get average xlr skill of both teams, if one is more than 50 (or 100) bigger then another, it switches players so average skill would be best possible (closest). That way it will never go too much. Hmm how about script is event which is run when one teams leads for 50+. If it was run once in map, it won't activate again (Sometimes new teams need time to balance).

But i must admit it was fun yesterday when fry, blinky, humppa and me pwned another team

@slap: i agree with uncle. It is cheat for stopping player from defusing bomb. That's it.

[eXtr33m]

@slap: i agree with uncle. It is cheat for stopping player from defusing bomb. That's it.

Wait what?? maybe i didnt understand. He didnt want to make it available for all, or did he?

[AimMe]

@slap: i agree with uncle. It is cheat for stopping player from defusing bomb. That's it.

Wait what?? maybe i didnt understand. He didnt want to make it available for all, or did he?

Noo, he said that it is pointless to give slap as it never helped. It makes bigtext and sound so it is annoying, and players don't get message. So i said that i agree with that. There's no point in giving slap to some extra users.

[Zottel]

OK!!
Ich verstehe schon, das es nervt mit dm text und so und ich verstehe auch, dass Ihr mir das recht nicht so einfach geben wollt.

Ich kann damit leben!
Es war ja auch nur eine frage.
Macht ja nix!

Freue mich das so schnell geantwortet wurde und auf noch viele spassige runden!

I can understand this, with the bigtext and sound, and giving me the right do not want to be as simple.

I can live with it!
It was also just a question.
Is not bad!

Looking forward, the answer was so fast and round to many more fun!

[SvaRoX]

Cookies (not your Cookie, another cookie. Uncle probably knows who i talk about) made a bot that would kick a player off the server if his skill level was too low.
If you can kick someone cause he isn't playing well enough, then it should be possible to create a bot that would activate if certain team isn't doing so well, and swap players from one team to another to balance things out.
That part is probably the easiest part. The hard part actually is how to make the bot stop. If it transfers too many good players, the game will just turn into one team destroying the other in turns. If it doesn't transfers enough players then it didn't change much.
So the main problem is how to create a "smart" bot that can determine how many players need to be swapped in order to create 'balanced' teams.

Hmmm can't we just make bot get average xlr skill of both teams, if one is more than 50 (or 100) bigger then another, it switches players so average skill would be best possible (closest). That way it will never go too much. Hmm how about script is event which is run when one teams leads for 50+. If it was run once in map, it won't activate again (Sometimes new teams need time to balance).

See one year old post post12004.html#p12004. Could be great that someone starts developing the basis so we can try various balance algorithms =)

[Rayne]

Yes you were absolutely right and it's the same thought i had too.
The skill balancing has to be real time and in the right moment.
And this is why it's so damn hard to make the thing.
Switching a player that has good XLR stats is ok but that player might have a bad day or his gaming hear is out of function.
So the data has to be drawn directly from the server and calculated with data currently avaliable.

K:D ratio is probably the best and easiest way to determine better players. And it can be easily calculated on the server.
So let's say a "decent" ratio is...1.5 and higher. Both teams should have same amount of players with that ratio. BUT what about players with scores like 5:20? The amount of those players should be just as equal. I saw games where one team would have 3 very good players with ratios above 1.8 but they lost cause they had 2 people with that can't shoot the house they stand in.

Meaning the bot can't just switch good players, but bad ones too.
And how to determine how many good players are needed in one team to balance the score and give one team some chance to win the round.

There is a lot of variables that need to be taken in account. In my opinion the switching of players would be so frequent it would only piss off people cause they're being switched all the time.

[eXtr33m]

Well do you have some actual code? I didnt write any plugins yet..

The easiest i can think of now is (players KD)+(players KD actual in map)=P, // maybe add skill too
if the difference (D) between the sum of each team is higher than X (constant) then it will find 2 players, each from another team, where |P1-P2| = D/2 then you switch them... maybe i made mistake i am in hurry...

[SvaRoX]

There is a lot of variables that need to be taken in account. In my opinion the switching of players would be so frequent it would only piss off people cause they're being switched all the time.

Yes and it should be taken in account, in fact as it is now for autobalance feature. B3 keeps track when it switches you so you don't change team each time the game is balanced.

Well do you have some actual code? I didnt write any plugins yet..

Go there : http://www.bigbrotherbot.net/forums/downloads/?cat=3. GL =)

The easiest i can think of now is (players KD)+(players KD actual in map)=P, // maybe add skill too
if the difference (D) between the sum of each team is higher than X (constant) then it will find 2 players, each from another team, where |P1-P2| = D/2 then you switch them...

(players KD)+(players KD actual in map)=P -> what are "players KD" and "players KD actual in map" ?

[Rayne]

Using KD ratio from xlrstats could deliver false results. My KD is as you can see very low, only 1.4 but on a right map (eagle) when I'm in the mood my KD can easily be 4:1. But due to my xlrtstats the bot might think I'm not suitable for switching.
So i think only ingame KD ratio should be taken in account.
If the difference between teams is say...30. The bot calculates the amount of players suitable for switch, splits it in half and swaps em with an equal amount if players with lowest KD ratio from opposing team.

If the number of 'good' players is an uneven number, say 5 it takes 2 good players but switches 3 bad players. If teams are balanced, the former 'good' team should have 1 player more then the new 'good' team.

If you can pull this off and code this plugin, every server owner with B3 will be eternally grateful. I know a lot of people asked if something like this can be added in 4.2/HD and it was rejected every time.

[AimMe]

I said it, only once per map. Not more.
For some normal balance what you say could be ok. BUT for great balance you need much more, including things that bot can't do at all. First thing is teamwork. There are tons of examples, like two players at same house, both with medkit, can gave more than 2x better score just because they are together. Or humppa and uncle on same roof on ramelle. You don't want to be on another team, just because of these two. Second is current map, but weapon too. If i play with negev or spas, i surely won't fix teams. But if i'm in weaker team, i'll take lr300 or sr8 and can get up to 2 times bigger ratio.
Thirdly is what i said year before, "noble sacrifice". When i rush some place all players turn to me and won't watch enter to that place anymore, which leaves huge space for incoming players. Still you should take healing, tactical play, current mood and so of player. Player to player relationship can affect game to. I like to pwn natirips, and play with him, as i can tell him where to go or what to do. I hate to play against norma or svarox, as they have great aim, and whole point of my style is not to get shot -> bullet in legs and i'm dead. That would be extremely hard to calculate, as you should take in account every player with every player and against every player... And even hardest things you can't calculate are human factor and luck. I can reach from 1:7 to 25:15 with no problem.

And one more thing: if you make balance, don't make it that it always switches weakest player and best player. Calculate average something of teams, and try to come to it best possible. Maybe it could change 10 players and bring balance, sometimes it could be just 2.

About actual autobalance, does it switch admins? Since i'm admin, i wasn't changed one single time...