!veto?

[felixmole]

Hi

I'd like to be given a few reasons for that someone can !veto a current vote. I'm not about to argue against it, but it's sometimes used without I can understand the reason. I might be newbz though.

I happened twice to call a vote for subterra on TDM. On the first time, ~ 25 players were on the server if I remember correctly. People were voting until someone !veto'd my vote call. On the second time (which happened a few minutes ago), I tried again to call a vote for the same map, and I got !veto'd a couple of seconds later.

No reasons were given to me on both cases - I didn't ask any though, I thought it was their job to tell me why I couldn't call a vote.

Thus, I'm wondering about:
- What's wrong with subterra? Even if it can be buggy when there are a lot of players, they can reconnect for once...
- Why don't people who !veto explain why they stopped the vote? I agree it can often be obvious (cyclemap, nextmap ut_sumo, ...) but sometimes it is not.

Thank you.

[Rayne]

I think I've read that cycle map vote can only be used if there are serious issues with gameplay on the current map (people unable to connect, a bug in the map or something similar). Otherwise a mod or a admin will !veto voting in order to stick to the map cycle text file currently in use.
I think it's a good thing. Last week there was around 15 of us playing late at night, it was after midnight, there was no admin or mod online and people called votes all the time, it was above annoying.

[HumppaLakki]

I can only explain why use !veto

Cyclemap: All the time. I hate to cycle maps
Nextmapvotes: Depends on the map, the amount of players and the teambalance.
Normaly i let pass every nextmap vote. I only veto if it is a small map on a full server (swim, dressingroom so on with 45 players online) or its just stupid. Like its a vote for a map which is still runing or was just befor.

In you case, subterra was removed from the mapcycle vote couse of the "cycled out" bug. So its get !veto all the time.
And call a vote which get !veto befor a second time.... if i would be online you would get a warning for votespam. If an admin vetos a map. Just take it. We know what we do

[AimMe]

I can only explain why use !veto

Cyclemap: All the time. I hate to cycle maps
Nextmapvotes: Depends on the map, the amount of players and the teambalance.
Normaly i let pass every nextmap vote. I only veto if it is a small map on a full server (swim, dressingroom so on with 45 players online) or its just stupid. Like its a vote for a map which is still runing or was just befor.

In you case, subterra was removed from the mapcycle vote couse of the "cycled out" bug. So its get !veto all the time.
And call a vote which get !veto befor a second time.... if i would be online you would get a warning for votespam. If an admin vetos a map. Just take it. We know what we do

+1
I do it same.

[felixmole]

I think it's a good thing. Last week there was around 15 of us playing late at night, it was after midnight, there was no admin or mod online and people called votes all the time, it was above annoying.

well, in such case, disabling vote calls would be a solution rather than !veto'ing each time an abusive vote call comes out. I've seen an admin doing this twice, I assume they still will be doing this way.

I can only explain why use !veto
Cyclemap: All the time. I hate to cycle maps

I hate cyclemaps too, and most of the time people who call such vote don't do that sparingly.

In you case, subterra was removed from the mapcycle vote couse of the "cycled out" bug. So its get !veto all the time.
And call a vote which get !veto befor a second time.... if i would be online you would get a warning for votespam. If an admin vetos a map. Just take it. We know what we do

Well... to be more accurate (if I wasn't on my first post), I did that the first time on past wednesday morning, and the second time, yesterday. Am I still doing things wrong?

The cycle out bug may not happen when there are not too many players, reason for that I called a vote for subterra when the server was far from being full.

[Cookie]

you should also probably be aware of the fact that there are maps which are preffered and maps which are not preffered. sometimes if you call a vote for a map a certain admin doesnt like too much, and the next map in the cycle is "better" than the one in the vote he will !veto it. noone will say it, but its true.

also the mapcycle exists with a reason. so its all very subjective.

as said by humppa, cyclemap votes are !veto'd instantly, and nextmap votes depends. if its a logical vote, most of the admins will let it pass. hell, even i sometimes call votes just to see if people want it, and then rastaskud !vetos my vote

i recently had a "discussion" with a player named 'Peace!!' who votespammed same map for 3-4 times in 10 mins. i warned him after the 2nd veto that he should stop calling votes. the "discussion" ended in him being banned for couple of days. reason i veto'd the vote was that there were very few players on tdm, yet he wanted to vote for a 'bigger' map...

i think i sum it up saying that !veto exists for a reason, and that admins in 95% use it accordingly... those 5% left...well its a perk that comes with the position

[natirips]

And besides, when an admin decides to do something, (s)he does it and no one will stop him/her.

Look at Google's Everything sidebar for example, zillion of people complained but there's still no way to remove it (to my best knowledge, at least).

[felixmole]

also the mapcycle exists with a reason. so its all very subjective.

Agreed, but the mapcycle is boring to death nowadays (yeah, it's subjective). I just want to sometimes insert some maps out of that mapcycle or the game really gets boring.

as said by humppa, cyclemap votes are !veto'd instantly, and nextmap votes depends.

I've given a thought about it, and actually, I don't think I have ever seen a cyclemap vote call ending correctly on TDM. Sometimes people just don't stop calling cyclemap votes, and the worst is that they pass when the map is good and the game is being fun, and fail when we want to cycle a map because the map rotation thingy failed and lead us to the same map than 5 mins ago. (by 'failing' I mean that the vote ends without being veto'd but not enough people vote yes.)

So I don't think anyone should call that kind of votes on the TDM server, but I've often complained on the IRC channel about this, but it doesn't seem to be a too-big problem.

[HumppaLakki]

its just a small thing.

The idea behind the votes was that players can vote for a new map and cycle the old map if the cylce fails (allways the same maps, only 3 maps at all, and so on) when there is no admin or Mod online.

When an Admin or Mod is online we handle the Mapcycle in the best way we can. Depends on what maps we preffere and so on. So there isent really a need for players to vote. But in fact... i wouldent !veto a normal nextmap vote.

[Cookie]

also the mapcycle exists with a reason. so its all very subjective.

Agreed, but the mapcycle is boring to death nowadays (yeah, it's subjective). I just want to sometimes insert some maps out of that mapcycle or the game really gets boring.

@felixmole: if you find the mapcycle boring there is a little map cycle link that you can click and vote for the maps you would like to play. imo main problem is the tolerance for big/small mapcycle switching (+- 7 players) which very often fucks up the cycle all together (same map loaded 3 times in an hour).

its just a small thing.

The idea behind the votes was that players can vote for a new map and cycle the old map if the cylce fails (allways the same maps, only 3 maps at all, and so on) when there is no admin or Mod online.

When an Admin or Mod is online we handle the Mapcycle in the best way we can. Depends on what maps we preffere and so on. So there isent really a need for players to vote. But in fact... i wouldent !veto a normal nextmap vote.

QFT